Prop Hate
Though I’ve shown my support for voting no on Prop 8 this November, I’ve stayed off my soap box this entire time. However after seeing a number of attacks on it from both friend and foe and with elections just around the corner, I feel I finally need to step up and say something.
For those of you who are unfamiliar with California’s prop 8, it is a proposition that if passed would change California’s Constitution and eliminate the right for same-sex couples to marry. The change would mean that the only recognized or “valid” marriage would be between a man and a woman. A similar proposition was passed in 2000 by California voters, but was later overturned by 4 Supreme Court judges.
There are a number of points I could make on this proposition that could be argued, but sadly I don’t have time to write a book. The biggest struggle I have with this, aside from the fact that it is discriminatory, is that I keep hearing people argue that “marriage” is a biblical term and that marriage between a same-sex couple is not “traditional marriage”. Both arguments which seem wholly rooted in the Christian faith.
If “marriage” is a biblical term should we not recognize the marriage of Muslims, Jews, Pagans, and Atheists? Clearly nothing biblical could support any of these faiths since they don’t believe in the Christian god and they weren’t married in a Christian church and clearly weren’t married under you’re the Christian doctrine of faith. Therefore the unions of anyone straight or gay from these religions shouldn’t be recognized or “valid” either.
Next it is argued that same-sex marriage is not the same as “traditional marriage” and a no vote will “redefine marriage”. Ironically Merriam-Webster’s Dictionary will say otherwise. If you look up marriage on Merriam-Webster Online this is what you’ll find:
1 a (1): the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2): the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage <same-sex marriage> b: the mutual relation of married persons : wedlock c: the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage
2: an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is affected ; especially : the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities
3: an intimate or close union <the marriage of painting and poetry — J. T. Shawcross>
As you can see traditional marriage and same-sex marriage are identical. The difference is simply who the marriage is between. Clearly the argument that they are not one in the same is rooted in discrimination and religion. If that’s not the case I would suggest you get in touch with the publishers of Merriam-Webster and let them know they’ve got their definitions wrong.
If you have religious beliefs regarding marriage feel free to have those beliefs, but don’t force them on the state as a whole. This isn’t about religion. This is about equal rights to everyone in our state regardless of their sexual preference. A no vote on Prop 8 does not force you to change your belief system; it simply allows those who might not share your beliefs the same opportunities and benefits you have. If two people love each other enough to spend the rest of their lives together, shouldn’t they have the security and rights that everyone else who makes that commitment has?
If you are for prop 8 I leave you with this…If you separate religious beliefs or discrimination from your decision process, do you have any reason to vote yes on this proposition? Would two men or two women being married actually impact your life or your well being? There are homosexuals all over the state that go about their lives day to day that you probably cross paths with all the time. Many of them are in same-sex unions or marriages that have already granted by the state. Are any of these couples affecting your well being? There are probably already some in your community that you don’t even realize are there.
I ask you again, if you are pro Prop 8 and you separate your religion or discrimination towards homosexuals from your reasoning do you have any reason to vote yes? Please consider this when you visit your polling place on November 4.
For more information on Prop 8 and why it is unfair, unnecesary, and wrong visit No On Prop 8
10 thoughts on “Prop Hate”
It will continue to amaze how many people will preach “do unto others,” from one side of their mouths while the other side is spouting hateful, fear-filled nonsense. If I didn’t agree with their lifestyle, and I most certainly do not in most cases, how would they feel if I sought to destroy their marriages? It’s so sad how many people think that logic is somehow anti-religious.
Anyway, very well said Mike.
Well said. I’ve grown tired of trying to make people understand though. Keeping the title of “marriage” between a man and a woman is so desperately important to some that they actually will break commandments and go against several other parts of the bible just to protect that one issue (WHICH ISN’T EVEN DIRECTLY SPECIFIED!!!)
No where in the bible does it specifically say that two people of the same sex cannot be married. Also, I don’t hear anyone bringing up Ruth and Naomi. One of the most beautiful verses in the entire bible is a quote from the book of Ruth in regards to her relationship with Naomi:
“Where you go I will go, and where you stay I will stay. Your people will be my people and your God my God. Where you die I will die, and there I will be buried. May the Lord deal with me, be it ever so severely, if anything but death separates you and me.”
It should also be said that the book of Ruth also mentions the fact that Ruth is clave unto Naomi. Clave being a Hebrew word meaning married.
But hey, they say its wrong, so who am I to point out their own “research material” to them?
This post is VERY well written Mike. My favorite part is:
“If “marriage” is a biblical term should we not recognize the marriage of Muslims, Jews, Pagans, and Atheists?”
I ask that all the time. I am a Christian, and as far as I see it, I would vote no on Prop 8. However, I have *heard* (haven’t had time to verify yet, will do though ASAP) that if Prop 8 doesn’t pass, there will be a proactive teaching of sexuality to young children. This sounds odd, and I’m pretty sure it’s propaganda, but again, I am not educated about it yet.
I don’t want my son learning about sex (of any kind) or marriage, really, from anyone but myself and my husband when he is in kindergarten or first grade. It’s just a kid-by-kid thing… not all kids are ready for the same info at the same time.
I will absolutely do all I can to instill within my children a love for all people regardless of whether or not the same beliefs are shared.
I have to admit, I watched that video that everyone is emailing about the “Diversity Book” sent home and no choice to opt-out. I think if the kids were older, I would say, ok, but I’ll tell my kiddos what I believe, and also that if they discriminate against people based on beliefs there will be an issue. Then they can weigh it all within themselves. I just don’t think the younger ones should be dealing with all these issues yet.
I know we need to nip discrimination in the bud from a young age… but there’s a way to do that and still let children be children. I think there is such a thing as too much information in this case. But I feel that way about many things; same-sex marriage is not even the largest of these by any stretch.
There are lines drawn in the sand… I do not think we can prevent, nor should we prevent, same-sex marriage on the basis of religion… and prop 8 has that written all over it.
Mike, again, this is a great post. I hope my comment-babble is ok 😉
Thank you all for your comments. I’m glad you enjoyed this post.
@KSan – I totally hear ya’. I had to laugh when I was trying to write this because I wanted an image to go with the post and one that I almost used was of a guy holding a sign that said something along the lines of, we didn’t vote on whether or not YOU got married.
@Shirley Tipsy – Love that you can quote the bible like that as support. I’m not as well versed in it and tried to find a passage to use in this post this morning, but failed miserably. I don’t want people to understand…I want people to THINK. I wish people could separate themselves from their fears and their religion long enough just to think and look at the whole picture.
@Anna – The school thing is propaganda. Nowhere in the proposition does it even mention education. The Protect Marriage site, which is the main info source FOR Prop 8 says, “It protects our children from being taught in public schools that “same-sex marriage” is the same as traditional marriage, and prevents other consequences to Californians who will be forced to not just be tolerant of gay lifestyles, but face mandatory compliance regardless of their personal beliefs.”
It’s propaganda and a scare tactic. They want parents to think that kids are going to be taught about homosexuality and marriage as early as kindergarten. What they fail to realize is if they don’t treat it differently it won’t have to be taught that way. They can simply teach kids that marriage is one specific thing between two people who love one another enough to spend the rest of their lives together. They don’t have to go into details and be like, “There are two types of marriages. There is traditional marriage and same sex marriage…”
I read that in California parents can opt out of certain teachings related to marriage, sex, and family if they choose not to have their child participate. So even if something did come about that parents were not OK with, the state gives them an opportunity to remove their children from it.
Yea, I find the propaganda that the yes on 8’ers put out to be incredible. Not a single, LOGICAL argument. I mean, FFS, they don’t “teach” marriage in school in the first place. Why on earth would they start now? I could…at least try to respect their opinions if they had any basis in logic, fact.
Really loved this flair: I’m sorry your marriage is so fragile but I’m still voting no on 8.
I’m a PC and I support marriage, no matter who it is between.
@KSan / @Mike – I totally agree; it makes no sense – I assumed it was propaganda.
It takes a lot of balls for me to comment on your blog every now and then Mike. I think this is comment number two but if I remember right I still felt as if I was the odd man out when commenting. Why not though; I can sit in the shadows and disagree or I can express my views like anyone else can… isn’t that what commenting is about?
My reasoning for saying yes is far more rooted towards how I want this world to look like when my kids are old enough to make decisions on their own and then my grand children and so on.
In America we have the right to vote one way or another on one topic or another and no matter what, when there are two or more sides there will always be someone yelling “Discrimination! Discrimination!”
You may call Proposition 8 discrimination but I call it my right and also my duty to stand up for what I believe in just as gay and lesbian couples have their rights. One of my best friends is openly lesbian and I wouldn’t change her for the world; nor do I judge her in any way what so ever. However just as she has a right to vote so do I.
My child is already going to be living in a world where gay and lesbian relationships are becoming more and more socially acceptable. I understand that I’ll never be able to shelter him from everything under the sun. I can do my part when it is asked of me though to limit the things I don’t like in this world and voting ONCE AGAIN against gay and lesbian marriage is exactly what I plan on doing.
@John I appreciate you commenting. Don’t ever be afraid to comment or feel I am going to judge or get upset. I love to hear other opinions and ideas.
While I whole heatedly disagree with you, I appreciate your comment. I also think you did bring up a good point. You can do your part when it’s asked of you. At least you’re voting, that’s more than a number of people do.